OutlanderBTS The Discussion, Episode 504 – The Company We Keep

Claire and Jamie in the Moonlight Walk scene, Ep 504, Starz

Here it is…. Life dictated that we were a small group this week, but the others are always with us in our minds and hearts. Please enjoy…

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18 comments on “OutlanderBTS The Discussion, Episode 504 – The Company We Keep

  1. Wonderful! I am listening to your favorite things and agree with all. You mentioned a few that I thought had even more connection to the book. I loved the walk in the moonlight. Yes it was perfectly Jamie and Claire, I would just add, with the humor between which we see more and more. By the same token, I continue to applaud the fact that, from the beginning, S5 has allowed TV Claire to show her love and appreciation of Jamie as fully and openly as she did in S1 – and inconsistently in between. (TV Jamie has had no such restrictions.) It must be satisfying for Cait to play that, as she has often described Claire and Jamie in interviews as we see them now.
    I thought the walk in the woods was taken exactly from the book, Courtney. As drunken revelry continues in the Brown’s trading post, Jamie asks Claire to go for a walk in the moonlight. They’re weaving in the new snow and Claire asks Jamie about being drunk, reciting the alphabets backwards, etc. The only difference is that there’s no snow in show so it has to be woods, where there were no few walks at Jocasta’s as well. That scene even stuck closely enough to book dialogue to give TV Jamie one of his languages back 👏. They do have the talk about the baby 😭💞💞 in the shed, where they step out of the snow, and where Morton later finds them.
    Marsali and Bree – I was surprised to hear the actresses say that the characters were originally going to be show antagonists and they had to fight for friendship. Even more to see a producer say they like to surprise readers with changes such as making them friends 🤔. The first 150 pages of this book focused on the two young coupled as friends raising their children together so – not surprised 🤷🏻‍♀️. In that context, I was even happier to hear that it was the writer who had done the background research to create Marsali’s story about killing her dad. I too have noticed how much Marsali sounds like Jenny. Further proof that the writer may be familiar with the whole series is how similar this story of Marsali’s is to one Jenny later (I think in MOBY) used when she guesses what someone else is struggling with, and tricks it out with a tale of her own. (Almost) all of Jenny’s most painful stories end up balanced by a tease or glint of humor. Something with which many survive pain, and the Fraser/Murray’s have refined to an art. Marsali is certainly a Fraser.
    The last adaption I’ll mention is the grave. The importance of us “seeing” Jamie digging the grave in the book is that Claire finds him there, weeping, while he carves it with careful intent. Her realization tells us that he’s not weeping for Beardsley or what he was forced to do for or to him. He’s weeping for his father, who died of the same affliction, who’s grave he didn’t get to dig and at who’s burial he never got to mourn. I think it was enough, in the show, for him to talk to Claire when he did about this emotional element, and leave mention the practical existence of a grave at the trading post.
    I loved all of your favorite lines, and the emergence of Fergus is more than welcome. 💝

  2. Hi, Ladies! Nice of you two carry on, even though Antoinette and Catherine were missed. I so enjoy your discussions, and thanks for doing them every episode this season!

    As I’ve mentioned before, I too listen to the Starz podcast, a day or two after the series broadcast, and it’s fun to hear what I might have missed during my several viewings, or occasionally was spot-on about. I find it helps me a lot before reading any blogs, or listening to discussions online. This week’s brand new writer did such a great job, and hearing her talk about the research she did was evident in what I felt was a great success! As a matter of fact, when it was up for grabs amongst the different S5 writers, the scene where Jamie dances was added to this episode, even though it was not originally in because the writer asked for it. I’ve also watched a number of cast interviews for E4 on YouTube…

    • In Rick Rankin’s mind, when when Roger was giving Jamie the background on “Captain”, he was playing it as though Roger was actually being sarcastic, sort of smart-alecky to Jamie, but that it was lost on Jamie…

    • OMG, finally Fergus gets to be someone other than a person a baby is handed off to, or passing an envelope to Jamie. What a tragic waste of Monsieur Domboy S5 has been thus far. I loved when he quipped to Jamie what a fast worker he was with regards to the baby to Jamie, and that was shades of the young pickpocket in Paris.

    • Sam wanted everyone to know it’s definitely not a sword dance, but the Highland Fling, and that as Karmine said, the specific placement of the fingers is meant to be stag antlers. I loved this scene and they said there was no specific direction given to Caitriona or the other actors, except to react as they naturally would, which was wonderful! Her look of fun, entertainment and joy during his dance is priceless!

    • Courtney, I too think that one scene was shot, looking at Brianna outside the Big House, as though it was someone watching her from the trees!! Dun-dun-duuuhhhnnn! 😳😱

    • Don’t understand why there is such inconsistency in the Germain character (script supervisor?). I get why they decided to up-age him from S4 baby to age 4 or 5 in S5 (where he can have a conversation with Uncle Roger about “hair ticks”), but then in this episode he can barely utter, “ball”, like a 1 or 2 year old…

    • But, BUT I am so happy that Jamie and Claire are back to being the focus of the series this season, and am thrilled. This was a terrific episode. The other day I saw an interview with Sam where he actually quickly mentioned but didn’t dwell on the fact that “perhaps the writing was better, stronger this season than last season.” That took me back to an interview with him last year, when he mentioned how important he felt it was that he and Caitriona were going to be producers this year, so they could have more input regarding these characters they felt so protective of. Bravo!! And I feel like, as you mentioned Courtney, there doesn’t have to be anyone at the expense of anyone, with regards to characters, and for me that means keeping Jamie and Claire at the core, as in the books. Lots of new players introduced this week, and somehow Jamie and Claire could still be the focal point. Just perhaps TPTB decided to listen to some of the outcry from last year…

  3. Oh, man! I was so sure I was limiting myself to one comment this time. But I have to jump in to the extended discussion about Fergus and Cesár. You covered so many of my thoughts, exceprted one of many, many favorite Fergus scenes, including a line that captures him to a T, “…having managed to transform the atmosphere from an armed confrontation to that of a Paris salon…” Brilliant
    The comparison between this Fergus and the Jamie the show surprised us with in the beginning of S2 is something that I thought throughout last season. Jamie has had some fantastic scenes and episodes since then – he was still the second lead, after all – and is now of the charts. But Fergus had only the jail break last season (behind which Marsali was the brains.)
    Did Catherine say that Fergus was castrated!? That is kind of what I thought as soon as I saw that his hook was gone. A hook is handy (sorry) a wooden hand, not so much.
    It’s also part of his charm. One of the things that allowed him to create the “Paris salon” was that the women were mesmerized by his hook.
    You mentioned some of the reasons Fergus knew what was needed in each situation in Brownsville – in the book, confidently and effortlessly. In addition to the experience in reading people he needed to survive as an orphan finessing the streets of Paris, he had already been to war, to battles lead by Jamie, having Jamie’s back through highest stakes political intrigue.
    We have actually seen Cesár given that Fergus to play in Edinburgh, as Jamie’s snuggling partner, demonstrating the charm Ian needed to get his first “date” – as any big brother would. He’s the first person to remind Jamie that he has someone else to deal with when Claire returns. And he is strong enough to stand up to Jamie – on the ship – and protect him from himself.
    One could almost think that once a man gets married on this show, he must suddenly become less than his wife. What is up with that. It gave me the creeps when Marsali negotiated with Murtagh to arrange a role for Fergus in S4. Just no. It’s the one oddity in a show adapted from a book in which all the characters are strong and smart, in their own ways and for good as well as evil – all in equal opportunity measure – and is all about strength in partnerhip/family/community.
    In 504, Fergus at least played a role, maybe it will keep growing. Or he’ll get a hook 😉.

    Regarding OLTV married men. Whatever of Jamie was frequently misplaced after S1, is back in S5 exponentially. And Sam is bringing all of him brilliantly. As you said about the Fergus that Cesár thought he was meant to play. This is the Jamie, all parts intact, that defined Sam’s character for a full season and intermittently since. The biggest treat is that this is the Jamie and Claire relationship that Sam and Cait (and I) were given to expect. 👏

    • I’m so embarrassed to have commented before the end, or I worked have heard you quoting me re Fergus’ hook! Not that I’m obsessed 😉.
      As long as I’m back… I thought The Company We Keep was just the two somewhat hostile camps hanging out in Brownsville together. Certainly anywhere Brown Bro Sr was hanging out! Very scary.
      The other possibility about the title is incredibly creepy foreboding.

  4. The company we keep- What about the arrangement that Jamie made with Richard Brown? The Browns are now part of the Fraser’s Ridge company. What a choice that will make, right?

  5. Hello ladies! Congrats on another lovely discussion..entertaining, thought provoking, and very comprehensive. Like you mentioned Courtney at the beginning, your discussions have a deeper layer than most other discussions found out there and it is much appreciated! Of course, Antoinette and Catherine were missed, and hope to see them next time, but you two did a great job.

    I agreed with almost everything you both said, including favorite scenes, as well as those things that did not work so well for you, so I will not reiterate them…what I do want to comment on though is regarding the costumes…and unlike you two, I am not a happy camper. I find that the materials used do not have the high quality feel that past seasons have had, I do not find a richness to them. The leather collar on Jamie’s outfit just looks wrong to me. Yes, the guns slung on top of Fergus’ and Claire’s coats look good, but that’s as far as it goes. All the material looks too new, they are not weathered enough for my taste. After all, these people are out in the country! Riding for days on end without washing of their clothing and there is no dirt on them! Jamie’s shirt is bright white! Even after bringing down Beardsley’s body last week, both Claire’s and Jamie’s outfits had no blood, no other stains they would have surely gotten from the man’s soiled shift (in the book Claire’s skirt is full of it). The coats, even though long, are not dirty at all. And can someone please tell me why Claire is only wearing a dark colored, long sleeved shirt and skirt..and nothing else (no shift, no bodice, stays, or jacket (as did the other characters in Brownsville) other than her long coat…sorry, it just doesn’t ring true to me. And lastly Fergus’ gaiters…holy heavens, could they get any baggier? And they are light colored! Again with no dirt or mud on them…what??? Okay, I’ll give it a rest.thanks for allowing me to vent about that part…

    Will say I am truly loving the cinematography and lighting this season! I felt during many of the scenes that I was looking at either a Vermeer or Rembrandt painting! Beautiful, just beautiful…

    Take care ladies, and thanks again for your wonderful discussions! Hugs to you all!!!

  6. Quite enjoyed the observations, some I agreed with, some I differed on, but it really ticked me off that neither of you seem to realize that the dance that Sam did was not the sword dance, and if one had done the sword dance they should have known that immediately; he danced the highland fling, which was another way for the Scots to demonstrate their rejection of the British oppression of their country; probably wouldn’t mean much to either of you, but as a citizen of a country dominated and dissipated by the English, I treasure every action that demonstrated the defiance shown, as evidently did Sam, since he was the one who decided to do the fling rather than the sword dance that Murtagh had performed in The Search.

  7. Sam has described that in several interviews, as well. It seemed strange that the swords were put down on the ground, so all the reviews call it the sword dance. The men before him could as easily have been competing in a Highland Fling.

  8. Well ladies, I thoroughly enjoyed your one-on-one session, although I did miss Catherine and Antoinette! Hope all is well with them and just busy!

    So maybe I’m all wet, but I kind of liked the scene in the bedroom with the three couples when Morton told Jamie and Roger that certainly they wouldn’t just obey and leave the women they love. I thought it quickly brought the dilema to an end and I loved the looks on all their faces saying, “well he does have a point”.
    Then when they left in the morning, yes it was light, but you have to remember, not only is it light early in Scotland, all of the Browns would be all hung over and sleeping it off, so it would be easier to get away. And about the room itself, it was beautiful, but that bedroom was just too luxurious for a house like that out in nowhere. Yes, I loved the walls Cathy, but it just didn’t go with the rest of the structures in the village.

    When Jamie showed up to find how Roger handled the situation, I laughed when Jamie said something to the effect of “so you decided to give away my whisky!” That was the first sign Jamie wasn’t happy with any of Roger’s decisions.

    I too loved the moonlight walk and Jamie’s gesture of asking Claire if she wanted to keep Bonnie. Simply wonderful and so thoughtful and loving. I have to say in this season, Jamie keeps all of his sweet and loving moments for Claire only and remains a stern leader to everyone else. So its wonderful how the warrior Jamie still makes time to show his love and devotion to Claire.

    The only thing that took me out of the 1700’s was in the beginning when Brianne and Lizzy were talking out in front of the house and the breeze lifted Lizzy’s poplin on her top allowing the viewers to see the chain stitching of a commercial sewing machine used by the costume department, exposing all the construction of the garment. I wish the director or somebody would have caught that and re-shot that scene. And I agree with somebody else’s comment about the costumes being too clean and tidy and some of the fabric not looking like the fabric of the day. Everything just looks too perky and clean. But on a good note, I just love how everyone looks, so there’s that too.

    Hopefully somebody sees some of these comments and gives Fergus some meaty lines and action like the Fergus from the books. You are right, he is such a handsome young man and with his French accent, he could deliver some wonderful lines and save the day once in a while. That’s why Jamie utilized him as a young boy in the first place and then grew to love him as a son he never had.

    Being just the two of you, you got a lot covered in a shorter time and Karmen got a chance to share all her thoughts, to the point that she ran out of things to say! Until next week ladies and stay well!

  9. I really enjoy these discussions, it’s like having Outlander friends in real life. I had really mixed feelings about the upstairs Romeo and Juliet scene with Isaiah Morton and Alicia B. What worked for me was the wry look Jamie and Claire gave each other when Isiah declared “I love only you”, dialogue straight from “The First Wife” where Jamie and Claire had their own bigamy drama. What didn’t work at all was Roger showing up; it felt like the show’s way of trying to elevate the Bree/Roger romance to Jamie/Claire level for viewers in a clumsy way.

    BTW, is this a pic of Karmen getting her stuff signed in this article?!
    https://www.townandcountrymag.com/leisure/arts-and-culture/a31082933/sophie-skelton-outlander-interview/

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