OutlanderBTS The Discussion, Episode 603 ~ Temperance

As I edited this discussion over the last 3 days, and watched the Oscars, Karmen’s words about temperance stood out for me. We really are just going through life, hopefully doing our best – finding our way. We make mistakes and we get things “right.” We learn and grow as individuals, and as a group. I talk about grace and redemption in this discussion; yes, we need more of that in this cancel culture. Catherine’s theme is family, including our bigger cultural, and even human family, while Antoinette is feeling and relishing it all. Outlander really is so relevant, as I look inward, and outward.  I am very grateful for this life we are so privileged to live. 

TEMPERANCE is moderation in action, thought, or feeling : restraint. And also abstinence from alcoholic drink.

Here is the article on red heads I reference: National Institutes of Health 

I found this photo on Pinterest of the Muckle Wheel – “The Muckle wheel in action. Scotland Hand Spinning”

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Happy Tuesday/ Wednesday!  xo

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15 comments on “OutlanderBTS The Discussion, Episode 603 ~ Temperance

    • I did notice him rubbing the palm of his hand absentmindedly in one of the recent S6 episodes and have been wondering why the pain he experiences when writing, and his occ. nightmares, have not been included in the scripts (or have they and I missed them)? I wonder if Sam added in the hand massage himself, as he did the finger tapping, based on the book’s descriptions of Jamie’s behaviors.

  1. Patti Foldessy, The scars on Jamie’s hand are from about 1743-44. Claire did such a masterful job of resetting the bones BJR broke with the mallet, and wounds from the nail, that, while the scars showed for many years after that, they tended to fade, just as the scars on his back did. This is now some 30 years after that in the story. You may have to look carefully to see the faint scars on the fingers of his left hand by pausing the video to see. Or, perhaps the makeup artist slipped and forgot to apply the make up for that scene. LOL. In one of the first scenes in 604 I did notice scars (makeup) on his right shoulder and left flank from the musket shot he sustained in S1-E101 and when BJR branded him in S1-E116.

  2. The grace of forgiveness, growth in understanding of what is right and wrong in life are encompassed by faith. Karmen expressed it very well. Faith has been a constant theme through the books; not going to church every week and ranting, but the gradual growth of faith as we grow. I made a comment on another site that Jamie telling Fergus that Faith will find Isobeil as true faith.
    That was received negatively by one person. The reasoning to me was shocking. Apparently Catholics can go around committing sin, not worried because they can go to confession. Apparently that is behind all of Jamie’s actions. I am shocked that people still think that.
    This person felt TC is morally superior because he lives by strict biblical rules. TC has no understanding of morality; we saw it at Ardsmuir, the minute he knocks at the Fraser’s door, his dealings with his children. He shows it that once his hand is fixed he whips Malva’s bare bottom. Alan got it on his clothed body. He shows it when he is affronted that Catholic read the bible. That is a laugh once all Protestant denominations are off shoots of the Catholic church; which is where they got their bible.
    603 sped by on excellence. It flowed like the stream poor Henri-Christian numbed along. Roger was excellent in his burgeoning pastorship.
    Jamie’s punishment was a test for the boys; they had to make a decision about themselves. The comment about Jamie kneeling down to speak to Germain echoes something I saw Sam do in a picture. He went down on his knee to a child. It would be good if we all remembered.
    César was magnificent as we knew he would be given the material.
    TC ‘s rudeness seems to be unbound. He pouts that he has waited a long time for Claire, the woman he wants to fix his hand.
    Jamie’s words to Fergus, after Fergus tries to die, are those we should tell all our loved ones, not just in times of illness. The two are excellent there; a great intimacy envelops them. It reminds me of the moment Jamie tells the priest Fergus’ last name to the priest.
    The surgery, personally I had no sympathy.
    Malva’s ability to use bible verses while flirting is quite the skill.
    It was good to see Marsali get mad at Fergus. It was honest and fearful.
    TC frequent mention that he is an educated man is a defense but it is obvious in his words and actions that he truly isn’t. Education means logical thinking not just parroting of ‘opinions masquerading as facts’.
    A little lighter; my husband had hardly any chest hair until middle age. The need for touch Jamie and Claire discuss made me think of some patients. Each evening we gave them a back massage. Many would say that it was the first touch they had in years. You could feel their bodies relax.

  3. Loved the review. Courtney, you hit the nail on the head. Jamie’s faith and morals, and Tom Christie’s, are essential to who they are. But Tom’s is without the application of grace and mercy (legalistic) and Jamie’s includes it. That is the difference. I wonder what Tom has experienced in life to bring him to this point. I think it’s a way to try and control situations that he feels unable to make right. I’ve felt this way myself, and I understand it. Then when I experienced God’s grace and mercy, he showed me I had to let go and trust in Him, and so I turned it all over.
    In terms of the redhead issue,I confirm that I have a high pain tolerance. I also need more novocaine at the dentist’s office in order to be free of feeling pain. And, it takes me a little longer to come out from under anesthesia I’ve noticed. I recently dislocated my right shoulder while falling on a hike. Waited to the next day to go to the ER, and they said I didn’t exhibit the normal pain indicator reactions, and were surprised that I had actually had a dislocation!
    And, I remember Murtaugh made a comment to Jamie in the wedding episode, about his “muckle” size. In that case, it meant “large”.

  4. I couldn’t wait for you to post this commentary and am just as eager for your take on Episode 4. There’s so much I would like to add, but it would be much too long. However, there are a few points I’d like to contribute.

    1. I agree 100% with Antoinette that everything that’s coming together this season is due to the writing. I also found Karmen’s comment’s on temperance spot on.

    2. In addition to the themes you mention, I’d like to throw in one more. Marsali touches on it when she says it’s the parents who need thrashing. Every character is a product of his/her parents–as are all people. Those parents grew up under (likely) less than ideal parenting as well as societal expectations driven by the politics, religion, and fears common to the era into which they were born.

    3. I love-love-love all the “picky” things you mention. Brilliant. Always. One which I also noted was Brianna standing, smiling and encouraging Roger as he preaches. That is directly from the books. Sometimes people don’t give Sophie enough credit and way more criticism than is warranted. Even when she is not the character who is the camera’s focus, she is embodying Brianna. She does that even more so in Episode 4.

    4. The comment about Mark Lewis Jones’s dental work killed me. When he first screamed and grimaced during surgery to reveal his upper teeth, I saw Homer Simpson. Now I can’t un-see that whenever he’s on screen. (I hope you enjoy it as much as I do.)

    5. It simply killed me that neither Jamie nor Claire bothered to tell Tom that when she did the surgery on Jamie’s hand he was hopped up on copious amounts of both whisky and laudanum, but let Tom “choose” to endure the surgery without anything in order to prove that he could be as strong as Jamie. He has no idea that Jamie’s recitations are pure Mackenzie mockery and manipulation, not comfort. Poetic justice.

    6. As for Jamie’s tolerance for pain (whether it be due to his hair colour or stubbornness), Dougal goes to some lengths in the first book to describe Jamie’s fortitude as a character attribute in order to persuade Claire to agree to the marriage. That passage reveals a great deal about Jamie. Who knows? He might be the masochist.

    7. One call-back line I really loved (in spite of not being a Frank fan) was when Claire tells Adso that she might be able to “rustle up some milk.” In Season 3 Frank comments on that American vernacular while cooking breakfast. “That’s what they say, Rustle me up some vittles.'” But who rustles up milk?

    Thank you for these hours of pleasure eavesdropping on your conversation.

  5. I thought it was interesting the Claire and Jamie made it seem that when she operated on Jamie’s hand that he withstood the pain without anything to dull it. In the books he had nothing other than alcohol to help but in the show he was not awake though most of it.
    Another thing is how is that Kessie has no speak impediment and seems to hear everyone just fine. Did his deafness go away just like Roger’s horseness?

  6. One more thing. I am a retired assistant to a Financial Planner and set up many Retirement Accounts for his customers. In 1984 the Retirement Equity Act was passed to protect spouses from their partner withdrawing assets without their knowledge. So when someone wishes to close or take money from a Retirement account their spouse must sign a document stating that they are aware of this transaction and approve.

  7. Another fabulous podcast! I think one overlooked element contributing to the excellence of this season is the extra time STARZ allowed them to have for these episodes. Matt said it gave them tbe chance to tell the story fully. That wonderful 7 minute intimate scene between Jamie and Calire probably could not have happened if they were limited to 60 minutes. Unfortunately, they have to return to strict limits for S7. I would love to have your thoughts about this.

    • I personally would rather have fewer episodes than 16 with longer times in order to get these great scenes. It has made such a difference in the quality in the writing, acting and editing.

  8. A great podcast for a great episode! Did anyone notice that when Malva was browsing Claire’s book of patient notes, we had a very quick glance at what looked to me like a full page drawing of a uterus with fetus, just before seeing the drawing of hand bones…foreshadowing/Easter egg for book readers?

  9. Courtney and ladies, I really look forward to your video reviews. I enjoy them so very much. I appreciate the positive approach.

    I personally would rather have fewer episodes than 16 with longer times in order to get these great scenes. It has made such a difference in the quality in the writing, acting and editing.

    Wow what a fabulous episode. I love the way that Jamie is anchoring these episodes. In the books he is the anchor for everything on the Ridge and in many cases beyond the Ridge, Sam certainly has the gravitas to carry that off, and he is able to bring the humor and as Annette says shady Jamie. Sam can throw shade with the best of them but in a very nice way.

    I thought Cesar was absolutely fantastic. Actually everyone from the youngest to the oldest is knocking it out of the park. I couldn’t be happier with this season.

  10. In depth discussion. Yes. The writing! Among many elements that may have brought improvement… the length of time working on the scripts because of filming delay. And Caitriona & Sam were more involved at that level and then on the ground.
    It was lovely to see Cesar get some time! His anguish was palpable. However, I didn’t feel his scene with Claire was a masterclass in acting … because while he beautifully embodied a state of being, I didn’t see… sense him playing an objective. If he had somehow been seeking comfort from his MiLady… when she tries but it doesn’t help… it would have been even more heartbreaking. No lines changed, just more behind them. One minor disappointment in script: Fergus speaks about the physician who dismembered the corpse of his dwarf friend & moments later Claire says “I’m a physician” … uncharacteristically insensitive.
    For me, the masterclass in acting was Lauren Lyle. She was phenomenal in her scene with Fergus. Not only did she (as she always does) have a strong objective…she played such a variety of actions…comforting, challenging, chastising, etc. in her pursuit of objective. Stunning. And credit to scriptwriting!
    Also, I want to give an extra shout out to Jessie as Malva. While we know the tragedy that will ensue… she is bringing such a complexity to the role. If you aren’t aware of what will happen… while we can see the damage done to her, she also gives us little glimpses of what she might have been. Like her quick kind smile at Rollo when he follows her and Ian as he escorts her home. Those glimpses will make her downfall even more devastating … and lend insight to a victim becoming a victimizer.
    The child actor who has most made an impression this season is Aidan … Amy McCullum’s little boy. His scenes with Roger are just lovely. He is a gem.

    • I’m not sure I would go so far as to say that Malva’s smile is kind. Geillis Duncan also smiled, but it was never without guile or intent to manipulate. I read Malva as a Geillis echo.

      Though I’m sure the audience on this thread knows all, I’ll dance around spoilers. If the TV version is going to follow the book, then we will learn more about Malva and her mother. However, that information is mainly from her father and brother who are not 100% reliable for their point of view. Men of that era were conditioned to think of women as Madonnas, whores or witches. And guess which category wily women of spirit fit.

      In fact, you could say that the downfall of Tom and Allan are equally devastating as they too are victims who became victimizers. Victims of the socio-political and economic forces of their era as well as religious doctrine and superstitions which shaped them. These complexities and multi-faceted characters and circumstances are what makes Diana’s books so compelling.

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